DragonPrime - LoGD Resource Community

Game Administration, Installation and Configuration => Game Administration Chat => Topic started by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 06:54:19 PM



Title: Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 06:54:19 PM
Can this game be more than an exact copy of a game from days gone past?

Can this game ever launch with a logon screen that doesn't point to Seth Able?

Granted, Seth was grand in his interpretation of dungeons and dragons in the BBS days, could there be a time when we all move forward and claim some history for ourselves?

A new game, that moves us all into a realm of adventuring that not only is based off of that which came before it, but actually builds on it. A game that keeps the tradition of Seths light hearted tongue in cheek perspective. But also provides the hard core fanatic with an adventure that keeps them coming back for more.

Can it?


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 06:59:49 PM
Can this game be more than an exact copy of a game from days gone past?

Can this game ever launch with a logon screen that doesn't point to Seth Able?

Granted, Seth was grand in his interpretation of dungeons and dragons in the BBS days, could there be a time when we all move forward and claim some history for ourselves?

A new game, that moves us all into a realm of adventuring that not only is based off of that which came before it, but actually builds on it. A game that keeps the tradition of Seths light hearted tongue in cheek perspective. But also provides the hard core fanatic with an adventure that keeps them coming back for more.

Can it?


As this is released under a new license... you can basically do whatever the hell you want, AS long as you make your modifications available for download.

Example: Xekral is making a Star Wars LotGD...

You can do whatever you wish with the core code, except for stealing it... because that can lead to a Lawsuit... and we don't want that, do we?

This game is constantly expanding. With each module that comes out, the game gets that much bigger. And as translation comes in, we get this game in many languages, which is spreading everything all over.

Some servers out there, such as Strider's, are RP intensive, and do build on the story. Such as with Ethygim... they go quite in depth... rather fascinating.

We are creating a new realm... one that is breaking away from the BBS Door games of the past... and each that is contributing, is putting their name into the history books...


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 07:24:50 PM
then lets stop restricting ourselves to level fiftteen resets and restricted atsmosphere. the core code is stuck on the original design of LORD.

So in order to expand it past this limit, we should move away from the core? I would rather stick with the core development. However, if the developers have no ambition to move forward, I suppose thats the only alternative.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 07:27:54 PM
then lets stop restricting ourselves to level fiftteen resets and restricted atsmosphere. the core code is stuck on the original design of LORD.

So in order to expand it past this limit, we should move away from the core? I would rather stick with the core development. However, if the developers have no ambition to move forward, I suppose thats the only alternative.

You are free to do what you want with the core... everyone is. If I want to go make 100 levels, I will go do that... no one can stop me, if I am not doing anything illegal...

All of us coders arent going to get up and just walk out on the core... the core is out pet, we need to maintain it, so that others may have fun whilst playing...

All this is, is a game... it is meant to be fun... over 15 levels, is not fun... it is tedious and time consuming...


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Talisman on January 06, 2005, 07:29:19 PM
Can this game be more than an exact copy of a game from days gone past?

I wouldn't really consider our current state as being an 'exact copy' LoRD...it is inspired by, yes, but has it's own life and personality.

Can this game ever launch with a logon screen that doesn't point to Seth Able?

Yes.  Edit home.php to read however you'd like.  Change the skins, change the texts.  The game can become whatever you want it to become.  Change the files, add tables - it is putty to be worked and transformed to appear and act as you wish it to...bearing in mind the license requirements, naturally.

Granted, Seth was grand in his interpretation of dungeons and dragons in the BBS days, could there be a time when we all move forward and claim some history for ourselves?

Some of our contributors, either with their ideas or their code, have never seen LoRD and speak from a fresh perspective.  From my own corner of the realm, I create that which I think I and others would like to see, and never spare a thought to "Would it have been this way in LoRD" or "How would Seth have done it".

A new game, that moves us all into a realm of adventuring that not only is based off of that which came before it, but actually builds on it. A game that keeps the tradition of Seths light hearted tongue in cheek perspective. But also provides the hard core fanatic with an adventure that keeps them coming back for more.

Can it?

How many LotGD servers have you explored...quality modified and expanded ones, I mean?  Yes, it can and it is.

Add to the mix people such as yourself who arrive with ideas - new or old - which may or may not have been discussed before.  The creativity of the combined community is what will propel this game onwards and upwards.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 07:36:22 PM
over 15 levels, is not fun... it is tedious and time consuming...

That statement is absurd. I regard that statement as a poke in the eye of any adventurer that ever tossed a die with greater than two sides.



Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 07:38:46 PM
That statement is absurd. I regard that staement as a poke in the eye of any adventurer that ever tossed a die with greater than two sides.

A board game is easy to level in... a PC game, where you account is held on a server, and unable to tamper with, instead of a character that you CREATE from scratch and can have it be waht you want...

And yes, I have played D&D, but more than 15 is levels, would be absurd for this game.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 07:50:23 PM
With stock game settings, today I had a first time player state that he defeated the main boss in the game, the Green dragon, in two rounds of play. He scoffed at it. I would be suprised if he spends another moment in the stock game after this. Your idea of more than enough is scant to say the least.
Press (F) 2000 times, start over...
Sure, I could expand the game to be a very intense afair. But thats not what this topic was for. I think the Core of the game should be expanded beyond whats released at this time. Beyond a pale copy of LORD.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Talisman on January 06, 2005, 07:55:34 PM
Perhaps you're approaching this code from the wrong angle then, Forge.  JT and Eric (IMHO) are doing a fantastic job of developing and providing this code.  The module system which was only introduced a few months ago has revolutionized the modder's role.  Rome was not built in a day, and neither will this game be built in a day.  They have been putting a lot of attention into the game's architecture, without which anything else will be substandard.

'Simple' improvements, such as breaking the specialties and races into modules as opposed to being hardcoded have further expanded the possibilities for customization.

They are providing us with a skeleton.  It's now up to us, the modding community and server admins to build on and around that skeleton.  Fifteen levels not enough?  Provide your users with something else to entertain them, such as quests.  I play on one (private) server which has a well developed quest/war scripting system which holds our attention nicely.  Many of the players have not DK'd in months.

Before making what I have taken as disdainful comments towards the core code and developers, provide some modules to make the realms that much more interesting.  Kendaer has made no secret of his willingness to examine and often implement code changes provided by the community here in DragonPrime.  Pre-release 12 would look very different than it does if he didn't do that.

You've made a couple of ambitious suggestions already...whether or not they're possible, who knows.  But go for it - that's what DragonPrime is all about.  However, if you don't think the current game and your planned mods are going to create the game you want, perhaps you're looking at the wrong game to start with....


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 07:56:30 PM
With stock game settings, today I had a first time player state that he defeated the main boss in the game, the Green dragon, in two rounds of play. He scoffed at it. I would be suprised if he spends another moment in the stock game after this. Your idea of more than enough is scant to say the least.
Press (F) 2000 times, start over...
Sure, I could expand the game to be a very intense afair. But thats not what this topic was for. I think the Core of the game should be expanded beyond whats released at this time. Beyond a pale copy of LORD.

I can not begin to analyze the invalidity of that statement... but, here is a stab in the dark:
  • Okay, beating the Dragon in Two Rounds of play, on stock settings, withouth ANY modifications, is impossible. You have obviously changed something, or altered something to create that statement
  • LotGD is not a "pale copy" of LORD. It is it's own game. It is 'based' on LORD, but not a copy of it. When did you ever seen a City called Esoterra (In the Core Code) in LORD? When did you ever see a Server Suspension for LORD? You didn't.
  • If this was a COPY of LORD, it would be continue to be played like it was... but it isn't
This is a game. Meant for distribution in a manner, where it can suit anyone's needs.

If you want to see changes, then change something. Make something, so that we can see where you are heading. Provide some kind of clout, to back yourself...

Research is key for any good argument. I suggest you do what Talisman had said, and go out, take a look at other 98 servers, and see how wrong you are.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 08:08:51 PM
Or perhaps I should kick a little harder in a different place. When a player of the core design, which I have decided to operate on at this time, and have devoted my server to, suggests in no uncertain terms that the main ambition of the game is scant in attainment, it should not only ring a bell with me, but it should be reported to the designers (replicators) of the game. Telling me that I should look elsewhere for server software will not run me off young man. I and others have witnessed this approach throughout this message base.
I pat the developers on the back for the sweet code that they have written. But sweet code written towards a dead-end just leads towards a dead-end. Talent such that they wield should be directed towards open ground, wither you like it or not.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 08:15:24 PM
Telling me to change things to suit the game is related to MODULE topics. This area of the BBS is related to Core design. So keep the Module related topics in the proper place, and lets get back to what I proposed in the first place.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 08:19:47 PM
Or perhaps I should kick a little harder in a different place. When a player of the core design, which I have decided to operate on at this time, and have devoted my server to, suggests in no uncertain terms that the main ambition of the game is scant in attainment, it should not only ring a bell with me, but it should be reported to the designers (replicators) of the game. Telling me that I should look elsewhere for server software will not run me off young man. I and others have witnessed this approach throughout this message base.
I pat the developers on the back for the sweet code that they have written. But sweet code written towards a dead-end just leads towards a dead-end. Talent such that they wield should be directed towards open ground, wither you like it or not.


The "sweet code" Is written towards Open Ground. With each hook that is put in, we are expanding the possiblities that the core can achieve.

I never told you to look elsewhere for some server software... I told you to go look at how wrong you are. People have taken the initiative to alter core code, as well as and in more modules, to create their own ambiance.

You claim to come from the D&D era... then be a Dungeon Master! Create your game, the way you want... you are trying to rally all of us, to create some kind of "new game" but the game we have, is good. I am sure when I say this, that I am speaking for all of us, we love to code off of the core code, as well as other's mods... it gives us something to do.

And don't bring up my age again...


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 06, 2005, 08:21:17 PM
Telling me to change things to suit the game is related to MODULE topics. This area of the BBS is related to Core design. So keep the Module related topics in the proper place, and lets get back to what I proposed in the first place.

The core is meant to evolve with modules. And by the way, this area is jsut for brainstorming of 0.9.8 code... modules are included.

If you want the core to change, the modifiy the core, and submit it to JT or Eric. If they like it, then it gets in...

Talisman already said this, so end your tirade now... you are getting no where.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 08:28:18 PM
So I take that as a STFU? Yeah, I suppose that was. Well, I don't remember pointing this topic in your direction. If you don't agree with what I have reported to the developers about a first time player discussing his experience with me about his first DK (BOSS KILL) in the game,  using stock setting, then you have made your under-rated opinion apparent to us all. Your assesment was that anything more was too much. A first time players assesment was that it was too easy to be entertaining. My game settings are available for scrunity at anytime.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Talisman on January 06, 2005, 08:29:46 PM
*ding*

Both of you get back to your corners.  If you can't discuss the game's further development without getting so hostile, find another place to do it.  Otherwise, get constructive.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 06, 2005, 08:43:22 PM
*ding*

Both of you get back to your corners.  If you can't discuss the game's further development without getting so hostile, find another place to do it.  Otherwise, get constructive.


Well, its a good thing you stepped in here Talisman. I was just about to pull out my Sword of ass-cleaving +6.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 06, 2005, 09:30:02 PM
Forge,

You asked a question, and it was answered.

Is it possible to remove the link to Seth?  Yes.
Is it possible to expand past the core rules?  Yes.
Is it possible to powergame past level 15? Yes.

Why are you arguing?  If you feel the game can be improved by such changes, then go ahead (so long as you follow the license).  No one is stopping you.

However, if you want others to support and help you in your efforts, perhaps you should try and convince people how the game might be better in your vision other than claiming to cleave people'a asses.

Personally, I think the core rules are becomming flexible via hooks, while remaining stable enough for everyone to have a ground zero to work from.  When people develop modules, they are trying to create something that will have balance and work for several people.   (Or they are making their module for themselves, and no one else, in which case they really aren't part of a discussion of furthing the game community development).  It's hard to create great modules, or further a game if everyone is playing by completely different rules.

In that regard, I think we should have a centralized set of core rules.  Those core rules change with each release.  The community does get to add content to the releases.  If you think you can suggest a way to change the game for the better, then code it up, and release it here.  Maybe you will see it released in a core release some day.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Elessa on January 06, 2005, 10:05:09 PM
:tucks a strand of unruly hair behind her ear as she arches a brow in amazement at the vituperative commentary

my, my, forge. ye had a single player comment that the game is not fun and was dismayed to slay the dragon in two rounds. how he managed that as a farmcreature i am rather intrigued to discover. however, be that as it may, ye mean to tell me the 5000 players on the central server don't know how bad they have it playing such a vanilla game.

this game is written with code in module format. ye are free to build upon the core to make the game whate'er ye within the scope of the license requirements.

if ye are not happy with the core of this game, by all means, go write thy own separate game with its own core that suits the vision ye have. no one is stopping ye.

also, as for thy commentary regarding the appropriate placement of discussion of modules, it is not possible to talk about the future of the development of the game WITHOUT discussing modules, nor would creating a separate thread for modules make sense.

i am rather certain that talisman has a pretty good idea of what to post where on this site and maintains this forum rather well.  

take a look around at the community here.  there are some mighty creative minds at work.

thy making a remark with regard to the age and qualification of one of the most prolific coders was rather unnecessary, arrogant and uncalled for on thy part.

as was thy comment regarding wielding a sword of ass-cleaving. shall i peruse my arsenal of weaponry to locate one in defense of what i am sure ye wish to swing in my direction as well as others. i am certain my claymore of damascus steel in a ladder hammer pattern and set with the bronze pommel and rondel on a malachite hilt will do me just fine.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 06, 2005, 10:23:10 PM
No dai-katana?


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Kendaer on January 06, 2005, 11:12:40 PM
Forge, I've read what you and the others have written.

I'm going to be blunt, as is my usual wont, so take it as you like.

The core, as it stands, is extensible.  It gives those people who have the intelligence, wit, creativity and desire the chance to extend it to further their dreams and goals and desires in what this game should be.  The core has and will continue to improve.   I resent your implication that it is a 'pale copy' of anything as that is dismissing the more than a year of hard work that I alone have put into this code base and the much longer time that Eric has put into it.

You don't like there being only 15 levels.  Okay.. you can modify your copy of the core to change that.  The code is under the CC 2.0 license.  You are free to make any changes your little heart desires as long as you provide those changes back to the community.  Period.   Personally, I believe that part of the charm and addiction of the game lends from the fact that it IS limited in scope.  I don't *want* to write everquest or some other infinitely expanding game.  I've done that.  I wanted and Eric wanted to create a game which had the feel and flavor of LoRD while being it's own creature.  I'd dare say we have achieved that.

Now, I'm going to say to you something I've said to many others.   Show us the code.  You have ideas.  You don't (yet) have any credibility in this community because so far you are all talk and no do.  You want us to respect and inspect and cogitate on your ideas, then give us something concrete.   Until you do that, you're blowing smoke.

Have a good day.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: SaucyWench on January 07, 2005, 02:40:39 AM
I find it interesting that the game is apparently a bland copy of LORD. I find it more interesting still that there isn't anything new in it. Please feel free to look at my signature; every single one of those is my work, every single one of those is in the core distribution file, and lo and behold I have never even SEEN LORD.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 07, 2005, 02:54:25 AM
Wow.

LoRD is definately worth playing if you never have.  Lord had hundreds of in-game-modules, much like LotGD's module system.  Each Lord game was fairly unique.

Many telnet BBSes still run LoRD.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: lonnyl on January 08, 2005, 06:17:30 AM
I'll keep this short and simple....

There is a reason that LORD was so popular.
There is a reason that LOtGD is so popular.

I can say that I have been through a couple of thousand (played for more than 6 months) ACTIVE players and very few have complained about the game being too easy.  There are a great many things (including and especially modules) that can and do reward you and add new things after multiple dragon kills.  I would like to see (and believe I will) more modules that are dragon kill dependant, so that as one levels up the realm changes and offers more and new things.  The module system is allowing one a great deal of contol over the look and feel of each game.  

I do believe that the dragon could have a game settings section for those who would like to make it stronger (and this may be a good solution for those who want to make it tougher).   Anyway I am getting away from short and simple... nuff said.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: XChrisX on January 08, 2005, 07:57:56 AM
I do believe that the dragon could have a game settings section for those who would like to make it stronger (and this may be a good solution for those who want to make it tougher).   Anyway I am getting away from short and simple... nuff said.


In fact, that is already easy makeable... there's the modulehook buffdragon, right before the start of the BigBoss fight... with the right module hooking in there you can make the dragon appear to you like a little bay on DK=1 and the the most evil creature imaginable on DK=20 and even go beyond that... So, if your players complain about bosses being too easy to be worth noticing - make them harder! :)


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 08, 2005, 08:10:40 AM
Don't you have a mod on your game to make the dragon tougher?


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: XChrisX on January 08, 2005, 09:30:34 AM
ehm... yes :)

but it still has to be tuned a little... :)

And I want some surprises built in... for now it just raises the dragon's hitpoints significantly depending on your dk-level...

(my last dragon had 2500 hitpoints... that's tough... :) )


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 08, 2005, 09:33:30 AM
I'd love to see it when you're done.  Looking at your game makes me salivate.

I haven't even played it yet, (can you play in English?) but the mod list (balance PvP, RPG mods, buff the dragon, questing system) all sound great.

That's exactly the type of game I want to run.   Balanced, challening, fun, and with a bit of role-playing and questing.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: XChrisX on January 08, 2005, 09:56:39 AM
to prevent unreasonable spammin ( :P ) I sent you some PMs on that :o


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 08, 2005, 04:08:07 PM
After looking over the MODS that I'm running here, and trying to decide how I would go about expanding on the game without hacking the core code, i landed on an idea that uses the elements in the core, and some of the MODS that have been released for the game by the best coders involved.
This would require using the Cities and World Map, Abandoned Castle, Trader MOD and Portable Potions.
Somewhere in the world using the World Map a Dungeon is created. It will appear to be a cave , in the back of which is an ornate door that has no handle or key hole. The door will be closed to a player until they have their first DK. Once they get a DK, they will find the door opened, and inside they will meet a spirit. The spirit guardian of the catacombs that lie beyond in the lower levels of the dungeon. There will be 9 levels, that require 9 DK's to unlock. The ninth level will be the goal of the MOD. On the ninth plane of Hell you will encounter Asmodeus.  He is a God, and will only be defeated by a player that has aquired powerful potions, scrolls and enchanted weapons/armor (which need to be added in the module). I was thinking that after consecutive DK's, artifacts of greater power will be able to be weilded by players, giving them the ability to drive deeper into Hell on each attempt after a DK. Each level of Hell will be populated by a Boss that will hold items that will be used against the next Boss in the lower level.
If a player suceeds in defeating Asmodeus, they will be informed by Asmodeus that they are now the keepers of the Underworld. The player becomes the Prince of Hell, and will be sought after, and attacked by everyone in the game. The login page will reflect whom the current Prince of Darkness is. Their name and duration of reign will be listed on a plaque located just outside of the cave mouth when you approach the entrance.
Now all that has to be figured out is what would the King/Queen of Hell do while they reign that would make that aspect of the game interesting enough to warrant going after it and keeping the title.
Permissions for using / modifing the different MODS that I have mentioned by the respective authors will need to be procured.  Any code that cannot be used, modified must be written from scratch and may hinder the use of currently installed modules that may conflict with such a MOD. Keeping the Core code intact  and unaltered, and avoiding complications with existing Modules, and using them when installed is a must.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 08, 2005, 08:34:25 PM
Hey lonnyl, since your modules are the most affected and possibly used by this idea of an expansion project, I would first like to hear an A-OK on using your modules to build on this project. If you decide not to allow your code to be used iin creating such an expansion, then it would require alot of extended code to be written to cover the same ground that you have already laid down in the game.
Please reply as to wether you will allow me and others to use your code to contribute to the game with my proposed project.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Sichae on January 08, 2005, 10:12:05 PM
Hey lonnyl, since your modules are the most affected and possibly used by this idea of an expansion project, I would first like to hear an A-OK on using your modules to build on this project. If you decide not to allow your code to be used iin creating such an expansion, then it would require alot of extended code to be written to cover the same ground that you have already laid down in the game.
Please reply as to wether you will allow me and others to use your code to contribute to the game with my proposed project.

Technically, you do not need his permission ... you just need to make the end code available and credit him for the code. Although, you can continue to wait for him to OK it.

Now, if you took the code, and then claimed it to be all yours, then you have a problem ... which would result you in what we like to call, a "lawsuit."

The CCL contains Core Code as well as all modules that are distributed. You can freely edit code, as long as you make the modifications available for download freely.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 08, 2005, 11:18:38 PM
I would never dream of touching another persons code without their consent. I have refrained from altering anything other than small changes that were required to make the game run on my system without errors. I hate error log entrys.
After looking at what is available for independant operators on the internet in open source development today, I landed on this project. This is the most advanced system in open source development gaming in the world.
I admire that the Developers have took a stand with their code base. Nuff said.
I respect the modular code that has been included into the distribution.
The standards that are in place merit high marks in the development community.
I have stood in the Pub too long tonight, downing ale and whiskey. to be of  any use to any of us. Please excuse me before I insult someone out of hand as I did the other night.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: Forge on January 09, 2005, 02:56:53 AM
did anyone realize that in the current world map mod, that if you set it to use 8 point keypad nav that if a user selects to navigate in a 70 degree angle they can  move outside the map, and then afterwards continue to move unencumbered of movement points until you re-enter the map at ones own digression.
one of my players relies on this feature/bug to move about the world at will.
just wondering if you all knew it was like this.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: enderwiggin on January 09, 2005, 05:44:32 AM
Forge,

I like your mod.  You can either directly alter the mods in question, and release your versions of them, or you can create a completely new mod that requires the installation of said mods.

Either way, I like your idea.  If you finish this mod, I may tie it in with alignment for evil players, and then do a similiar quest for good players.


Title: Re:Acceptable Ideas
Post by: lonnyl on January 09, 2005, 06:52:30 AM
I am one that is for adding depth to the game at any avenue....  Certain things I do not use as I don't feel they are quite right (the world map for one... it needs just a little bit more before I intend to use it).  But yes adding substance and depth to the players character (as with alignment, odor, bladder, and hunger) makes for a little more to do in the game besides kill forest creatures, kill the dragon etc.....   Now the game has come quite a way beyond that on it own, but anything beyond that is always a plus.  And the wonderful part of the module system is that one can decide to use a module or not.....  

As for my modules being incorporated into other projects or into the core for that matter, I have no qualms with that.  I do not however actively seek such things.   Use what ever modules you would like....  I am not here (as a part of this community) to hinder any aspect of this game or others use of it.  There is very little that I have created that I do not share, and the ones I don't is because I don't feel they would be generally useful to the rest of the community.

Have fun with your project, and let your friends know that you will see them in a couple of months.....  ;D

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