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Village Square => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: sixf00t4 on December 21, 2004, 11:04:50 AM



Title: dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on December 21, 2004, 11:04:50 AM
highly experienced dragonslayers have noted that it's a waste to use dragonpoints on anything but forest fights.  i have a player who will get his 140th dragon kill tonight, because he gets 162 forest fights a day.  i was wondering if anyone else stumbled upon this.  any counter ideas?


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on December 21, 2004, 11:48:24 AM
there a vampire out there, which takes away maxhitpoints... why not something, which happens on newday, which randomly changes and mixes the dragonpointspent?

or in 0.98 block the nav for forestfights after a DK if the player has execeeded any given maxforestfights

That's what I would try...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Finwe on December 21, 2004, 02:14:20 PM
I would have to say blocking after a certain amount of ffs are achieved.  Just like the limit on hp points in the inn.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: strider on December 21, 2004, 04:57:56 PM
Aye, about time for a new balance against Permanent forest fights.

The other idea would give characters the option to spend Dragon points on something else.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Elessa on December 21, 2004, 07:10:37 PM
Aye, about time for a new balance against Permanent forest fights.

The other idea would give characters the option to spend Dragon points on something else.

such as an additional pvp fight, perchance, for those who indulge in such sport? or perhaps skillpoints towards spells?


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: strider on December 21, 2004, 07:11:30 PM
Sure, I'd even write it. . .  for any server but LEGENDGARD.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Elessa on December 21, 2004, 07:17:07 PM
i think though, that with an additional pvp fight, there would need to be a max limit set to how many could be acquired total. i could see someone running rampant and ripshod over others.

however, i simply posit a suggestion. tis up to those of ye who wield the scepters over realms to figure out how to maintain balance in thy realms.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Elessa on December 21, 2004, 07:21:03 PM
highly experienced dragonslayers have noted that it's a waste to use dragonpoints on anything but forest fights.  i have a player who will get his 140th dragon kill tonight, because he gets 162 forest fights a day.  i was wondering if anyone else stumbled upon this.  any counter ideas?

the main reason i see that it is more beneficial to spend the point upon a forest fight is that the fighting system itself penalizes you when you have higher stats in the other options.  

there is an issue of balance that needs to be adjusted within that also. if it were done, i suspect that points would then be spent for the attack or defense.

hitpoints simply become far to costly too heal and are not worth the expense.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: jened on January 14, 2005, 07:55:08 AM
highly experienced dragonslayers have noted that it's a waste to use dragonpoints on anything but forest fights.  i have a player who will get his 140th dragon kill tonight, because he gets 162 forest fights a day.  i was wondering if anyone else stumbled upon this.  any counter ideas?

maybe take away autofighting for bonus fights


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: enderwiggin on January 14, 2005, 11:23:02 AM
I'd like to see a cap of 25 (customizable per server) for any permanent dragonkill benefit.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on January 14, 2005, 11:55:12 AM
and then? after 100 DK you're standing there and do what...!? Limiting every choice is nothing, I'd like to see...

maybe something more to choose instead of limiting...

increase the chance to find an extra-gem (0.5% in addition to the existing server setting per forest fight and dragonpoint spent... ) or extra gold (3% per forestfight and dragonpoint spent)


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: enderwiggin on January 14, 2005, 12:05:45 PM
Why not have both?

Limit the max you can have on any particular permanent advantage from DK's to 25 (once again, a configurable number) and at the same time, add other things you can buy with DKs.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on January 15, 2005, 03:40:50 AM
maybe Kendaer might be willing to add a modulehook in newday.php, line 52, which could allow to add things to choose for dragonpoints to spend...

then one could write modules to implement other bonuses... applying these would have to be done via the "newday" hook... That should be no problem...

And for the limitation of dragonpoints: one could write a module, that checks whether a player has spent more than a certain amount on one thing (def, atk, ff, hp) and then warn them (and block the navs via that new modulehook to prevent further choosing...)


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Perdition on January 19, 2005, 01:37:58 AM
One of the issues seems to be that you have to spend your DK points immediately. If you could save them up you could have options for 2 DKs, or 10 etc etc. Giving the more powerful people something to save for. This is particularly useful for the serious role players who would happily give 10 DK points for a custom name or anything which sets then apart from the mob.

Some random ideas for dragon points (the more unique would be for multiple spends)...

- New Day Favour - Users gain x favour on a new day with raimus (One for the Vampires and the suicidal)

-- Extra PvP

--Extra Mount Buff rounds - x extra buff rounds for your mount

--Extra General Buff rounds - x extra buff rounds for none mount buffs

--More travel (only for multi city obviously)

--Store Discounts - Could be specific for each store to pad it out a bit, -5% at the Armour shop etc

--New Day Charm - User gains x charm per new day

--Increased starting use point for Magic

--Named Mounts - Users often comment they can name their sword but not their horse (Name steed for 3DKs etc)

--Name End Tag - Users can choose one of x tags for the end of their name, particularly useful for the gods who have nothing to go for (So "God Player" could become "God Player the Magnificent" or whatever)


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on January 19, 2005, 01:41:07 AM
if there was this modulehook, you could just store these saved draponpoints and after each dk you could ask the user to either un-store the points or buy something from the dragonpoints... That should be possible and easy to do...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Sneakabout on January 19, 2005, 01:53:30 AM
This sounds like a really cool idea.... storing Dragonpoints will allow for so much more flexibility it'd be great. If this could be implemented, it would change the game for the better.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Kendaer on January 19, 2005, 07:52:28 AM
This sounds like a really cool idea.... storing Dragonpoints will allow for so much more flexibility it'd be great. If this could be implemented, it would change the game for the better.

I actually strongly disagree with this sentiment.
I will consider adding the hook, but it's not there yet, and I need to think about it a bit more.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Talisman on January 19, 2005, 08:26:34 AM
I strongly disagree with the concept of capping dragonpoint expenditures - it removes the player's motivation to DK and winds up forcing every player to follow essentially identical strategies.  The current ability to try unique strategies should not be hampered.

All of Perdition's suggestions for things such as titles, coloured names, etc can easily be achieved through other means/modules, tied or not tied to DKs.  The pointsystem granting access to such features can also be tailored to favour (or not favour) the more experienced players.

While some of the suggestions do have merit, I would suggest that dragonpoints is not the best avenue for achieving them.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Elessa on January 19, 2005, 08:38:19 AM
the spending of dragon points are best spent on those things that make the character who s/he is.  s/he has spent time fighting in the forest, training with the masters and then slain the dragon.

as a result, what has that done for the character's development? they are now stronger, more nimble, healthier or have more endurance.

the spending of the dk points should, in my opinion, relate to the physical achievements in relation to the experience of slaying the dragon.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Sneakabout on January 19, 2005, 08:54:38 AM
Aye, I was thinking of saving up for extra PvPs, etc...... as well as improved specialty use points. Those would be the kind of things I'd save up for.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on January 19, 2005, 08:59:54 AM
or atleast give them that option to save them up for something better.

Quote
what do you want to spend your points on?
FFs- 2 dragon points
max hitpoint - 3 dragon point
attack point - 1 dragon points
defense point - 1 dragon point
I don't want to use one this time



Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on January 19, 2005, 09:40:29 AM
@elessa
gaining more experience through spent dragonpoints could be something to reflect the better condition of a mage like character...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Elessa on January 19, 2005, 10:11:09 AM
@elessa
gaining more experience through spent dragonpoints could be something to reflect the better condition of a mage like character...


quite true. an option to spend dragonpoints on an additional spell/skill point would be valid.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on January 19, 2005, 12:19:22 PM
and that's why it should be done via modules... ;) some might think it's not what they want, some might think, that buying stronger skills should be done via dragonpoints, some might just say, "hey, give them 10 gems for that dragonpoint". It depends on their server...

BTW: it's the only part of newday.php, which has no modulehook  :P


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: enderwiggin on January 19, 2005, 02:04:38 PM
I would really like to see more options on what you can spend DKs on even if we're not going to put in any option to cap spending.  


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: Kendaer on January 19, 2005, 03:11:11 PM
BTW: it's the only part of newday.php, which has no modulehook  :P

*that* in and of itself is not a reason to add one :)

And you know, you could always hook on newday-header (or newday-footer) and check the httpget("op") or whatever to determine which branch of code you are in, yes?

Basically I think that half of the current module hooks could actually be removed/replaced with hooks on header/footers for those pages, but it'd be a pain in the arse :) However, that does make me unwilling to add in those sorts of hooks as well since they are already 'available'.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on April 15, 2005, 02:34:10 AM
well, just sat down to write a dragon point spending system for site points and noticed the hooks aren't there.  Should i continue with the newday footer method?

another idea for dragon kill spending points would be for extra gold or gems.  Or even, like site points, things that are only obtainable with dragon points.  such as custom weapons or a free newday, etc.

just trying to see if you have decided either way on puting in the hooks.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on April 15, 2005, 02:55:53 AM
Maybe header-newday might be more suitable... I'm not sure, if the $_GET['op'] gets altered somewhere in the script and with the header you can place your navs and checks before something like this happens... :)

Maybe (just a suggestion) you might want to make a module to save dragonpoints and providing that modulehook we need.

And then a module for each additional dragon point option using your newly created modulehook.

Yes, one additional database call. But no so much PHP has to compile if someone turned some of the options off... ;)

BTW: Finish this quickly... I already got addicted by that idea... :P


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on May 11, 2005, 04:07:39 AM
I tried, i sucked, i failed.  I tried to create that hook in the area we need, but it won't show...I've attached what i tried.


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on May 11, 2005, 05:08:13 AM
Okay... you nav-header will never show, as you have no nav underneath the header... ;)

have a look at my attached file, it'll give you mount extra rounds for the dragonpoint...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on May 11, 2005, 06:34:26 AM
ok, so next step...
I attached a module that makes forest fights cost more than 1 DKpoint, and just as i was finishing it, i realized, they aren't able to save up their dkpoints because everynew day they are directed to spend points.

so now i am thinking that we need a module that gives a nav to "don't spend points this time around", but somehow doesnt make them spend points everynewday, but gives them the option again after a DK, i *think* it can't modify $session['user']['dragonpoints'] either...

too much work than what it's worth?


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on May 11, 2005, 06:39:31 AM
ehm... simply set their current dkpoint to 'save'. And after a DK (header-newday, $session['user']['age'] == 0 !) count the 'save'd dragonpoints.

if there are two or more -> make your nav available...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on May 11, 2005, 07:26:13 AM
yeah, hmmm, i guess that would work to save them there.  I was thinking that all the dkpoints had to go to what you spent them on, but i guess just the last one does...

but how do you set saved dkpoints to 0 after spending them on something else?  in other words, how do we manipulate the already spent dragonpoints?

would it be better/worse to use module_prefs on this, adding to both the module_pref and dragonpoints when they save points, and just setting the module_pref to 0 when they spend saved points, and basing the check to see if they have enough saved points off the module-pref


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on May 11, 2005, 09:11:46 AM
Hmmm yes... making a modulepref would be the right way...

Let's say we have the "save" option. And we have a counter for each player, how many of those saved points are already spent.

and on header-newday we check if ($savecount - get_module_pref("spentsave") > $whatevervaluewewant)...


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: XChrisX on May 11, 2005, 09:24:06 AM
Just check this file for how to do it... (Yes, I've done it again...)

http://dragonprime.net/users/XChrisX/dksave.zip


Title: Re:dragonpoint spending strategy
Post by: sixf00t4 on May 11, 2005, 10:48:11 AM
NNOOOOOOO!!!!! i actually did it myself this time!!  :)

give me a sec to upload and post the modules

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